The Curse of Macbeth - Ep. 12

Why do theater people refuse to say Macbeth inside a theater? This week on Cursed...ish, we step into the blood-soaked, witchy world of Shakespeare’s most allegedly-cursed play: Macbeth, also known by the superstitious as “The Scottish Play.”

Angela takes Daniel through the strange history behind the curse of Macbeth, from one king's weird, misplaced obsession with witchcraft and Shakespeare’s suspiciously well-researched trio of iconic witches, to the chilling discovery that real incantations may have been written into the very play itself. Did Shakespeare accidentally, or maybe not so accidentally, put actual magic onstage?

Then we follow the supposed victims of the Macbeth curse across centuries of theatrical disaster: an actor allegedly dying before opening night, the Great Storm of 1703, the deadly Astor Place Riot of 1849, falling stage weights, accidentally-sharp prop swords, mysterious production deaths, stage injuries, kerosene-soaked costumes, and one extremely unfortunate bike accident.

But is Macbeth truly cursed? Or is one of the most-performed plays in the English language simply old enough, popular enough, and chaotic enough to collect a long list of theatrical disasters?

This episode has witches, Shakespearean ass-kissing, toxic theater fandom, dead sheep carcasses, cursed stage traditions, and the eternal question: is it cursed, or just cursed...ish?

Questions, comments, or your own accursed tales to share? Send us a hex at uhoh@cursedish.com.

The hosts of Cursed...ish are not responsible for any misfortunes that may befall you while listening to this podcast. By listening to Cursed...ish, you assume all risk of bad luck, ill omens, and unexplained catastrophes.

*Terms and conditions may be upheld by unknown forces.

Transcript

Angela 0:00

The night of the opening of Macbeth, the actor playing Lady Macbeth died just before the play opened, and Shakespeare had to play the part himself. But one caveat, it's 1606, dying is not the same kind of thing back then. It kind of happens more often and more frequently.

SPEAKER_02 0:13

But right before the play, that's still bad.

Angela 0:27

Welcome, Accursed Ones, to Cursed Ish, a podcast about misfortune, strange happenings, and the general skullduggery that comes along with just being alive. I'm Angela Mattis.

Daniel 0:38

And I'm Daniel Stevens.

Angela 0:40

Daniel, I am so excited for our curse today, but I do have to apologize to you in advance because I stole this one from you, I snatched it from your list.

Daniel 0:50

Oh no.

Angela 0:51

I wanted it. I'm sorry, and it ended up being so much better. I had no idea. I learned so much about this curse that I'm sorry, but I will accept whatever consequences of my actions. But did you have your cold dead fingers clutched around the curse of Macbeth?

Daniel 1:10

Oh, uh, I mean that's a good one, but that is not one of my personal, you know, pieces of my heart that I would absolutely die if you stole.

Angela 1:19

Good, good, good. It's mine now.

Daniel 1:20

I was excited to look into it, but I'm excited to hear you tell me about it.

Angela 1:23

Okay, I'm really curious when we get to the end of this, if you even know this curse. Because again, I've heard of the whole Macbeth curse. I knew there was a curse related to the obviously the famous Shakespeare play.

Daniel 1:35

The Scottish play.

Angela 1:36

The Scottish play. Yeah.

Daniel 1:38

Yeah. I mean, I have a general concept of it. Obviously, we, you know, we knew enough about it to put it on our lists when we were brainstorming ideas, but I'm I I really don't know.

Angela 1:46

I honestly would not have thought of it until I saw it on your list and I was like, ooh, who's that? And then I'm just gonna go.

Daniel 1:52

Okay, so you're 100% just thievery.

Angela 1:55

Yeah, just full-on just thievery.

Daniel 1:58

Well, I'll I will keep this in mind when you come up with a great idea, and then I'm like, ooh, why didn't I think of that one?

Angela 2:05

You get one good one. You get one time to just be like, uh-uh, and like snatch something back from me. Look at my list.

Daniel 2:12

I'll make sure it's not one of your personal, you know, I wouldn't steal certain things, of course.

Angela 2:17

I don't know if I have anything that's like that, so you can't hurt me.

Daniel 2:21

Okay, we'll see. We'll see. One day you'll curse my name for stealing your your your great episode idea.

Angela 2:28

Moving on. Okay. So it's the early 1600s, and there is a global sensation rocking the nation, and it is called witchcraft. And this is it's actually a hundred years at this time before it makes it all the way to the Americas where the Salem witch trials take place. That was like 1690 something, like late 1600s, but it's the early 1600s, it's about 1604 when our story begins. Um, actually, Macbeth was written in 1606 or seven.

Daniel 2:58

It was earlier than there. The the witchcraft craze was there in Europe earlier than in the in the colonies, I guess, basically. Yes.

Angela 3:06

As always, we're late to the game, we're late to the trends.

Daniel 3:10

It's like the Beatles invasion proto version.

Angela 3:13

Yeah, yeah, except for like a lot of people died in really shitty ways.

Daniel 3:16

So a more nightmarish version.

Angela 3:19

Yeah. Um, so it begins with King James, and this was um King James of Scotland, and his mother was Mary Queen of Scots, and as we all know, or as we will probably find out in a future episode, as long as I don't snatch it up from ya, she did not go peacefully, and he had some trauma as a result. Um, and according to James, his mother's death had been predicted before it happened. Like there were different clairvoyants that had seen her bloody head dance dancing, so not cool. Um, and he became obsessed with sorcery and witchcraft, but like not in a good way. Like he wasn't for it, very much was against it.

Daniel 3:56

Yeah, I mean it seems like a lot of people back then were anti-witchcraft. They were probably, I mean, there weren't that many real witches pr practicing pro-witchcraft, I feel like.

Angela 4:04

It was mostly just a uh I don't know, because it kind of takes me back to like the the Egyptian episodes where it's like years and years and years of all of this like sorcery and these spells, it's like, and it never worked once. And then also, like, you know, even in England, um, I know we mentioned Stonehead at one point. I don't remember which episode it was in, but it's also like there was something in going on there that made them be like, let's move these stones a hundred miles for no reason, even though they're like three tons each. Like, there maybe was something going on that just didn't quite make it through the annals of time.

Daniel 4:39

For sure, maybe, but also we humans as a whole are great at seeing thing A and assuming it caused thing B, even if those things are not really. I don't know.

Angela 4:49

Well, if thing A caused me thing B to get burned at the stake, I'm gonna stop thing A immediately unless it's like really paying off.

Daniel 4:56

I'll agree. I will definitely agree if burned at the stake is the outcome, I will avoid that at everyone. Yeah, like I'm gonna immediately walk that shit back unless that shit was like making moves for me. Yeah. But you know, people, people rituals they think they work whether they do or don't. So I mean they're doing it because a concept that it works at all.

Angela 5:15

Well, yeah, that's fair. Because actually, that kind of brings me to the next point. So King James had been on a boat ride in the ocean with his betrothed Anne of Denmark, which actually there were like two stories, and I guess it's been a couple hundred years, so excuse me if I got this wrong. Um, but apparently his betrothed Anne of Denmark was either in a boat on her way to him or he was on the boat with her. I read two different accounts, but essentially a tempest, a great storm, rose up and they almost died, or she almost died at in a shipwreck. And King James declared that the storms had been created by witches and witchcraft, which I mean shortly like, yeah, storms at sea, very rare thing to happen to anybody.

Daniel 6:01

So definitely witches. Let's round them up.

Angela 6:04

Definitely witches. So maybe it was kind of a confluence of um people doing something and then something just like hilariously um coincidentally happening, or just nature acting like nature, and you and King James assigns it to witchcraft.

Daniel 6:23

I think it's him him taking advan maybe not advantage. He probably I don't know if he took out enemies. There were definitely, I know I remember learning in history class the Salem witch trials, many of those people were just political or personal. Oh, yeah, they were just little brats.

Angela 6:37

Like they were just being like Twatskill or just killing each other over like some shade.

Daniel 6:42

Awful. Just awful, awful, awful. So whether James, whether he was doing that, I mean, it's still not great if if he was just taking his anxiety at the world out or anger at the his inability to control the weather and taking it out on random women.

Angela 6:58

We've learned enough about men in power in the 13 to 16 to, I don't know, like current day, modern times, that they're all embrolled in a lot of bullshit. So I'd I would guarantee, I honestly feel like I feel like King James is one of those people who has one of those Wikipedias that probably reads just very delightfully. But he actually went from being the King of Scotland to then becoming the King of England, and so he got a little promotion. Um, but I was gonna look it up, but I was like, we don't need that history lesson right now.

Daniel 7:29

We're already learning enough about I was just gonna say that's interesting because I don't know much about that, but I know obviously my concept of Scottish and English history is England was constantly attacking and trying to conquer Scotland, so a Scottish king becoming the king of England is like confusing to me.

Angela 7:47

But that's I got all of my Scottish history from a historical program called Outlander.

Daniel 7:53

So it's gonna say Braveheart.

Angela 7:55

No, no, learned a couple other things while watching Outlander as well.

Daniel 8:02

Yeah, yeah.

Angela 8:03

Um, I know I thought about it. I thought about like doing some big old deep dive into King James, and then I was like, he's not even that important to the story. Move along. So I'm sorry if you came here wanting um a play-by-play of Scottish history circus 1600. This isn't the podcast. We're moving on.

Daniel 8:22

Maybe one day if we circle back and do like a deeper dive and a three-parter on Macbeth, you can do a whole episode setting the stage in Scotland.

Angela 8:30

Yeah, come back in like year five when we've talked through all the curses and we're just like scraping for the dregs, and then we'll talk about this. Um, so it's about three years into King James's rule as the King of England, and he was very well known for his hatred and distaste for witchcraft. He wrote The Demonology, a treatise defending witch hunting. So he was a man on a mission, ready to take it all down.

Daniel 8:58

At first, I was gonna say I would that sounds like a cool book, but I uh defending witch hunting is not, I mean, I was expecting him to like catalog their like the demons they knew and everything. That sounds cool.

Angela 9:08

How many of these men have we discussed so far? Maybe like one. I always just take everything back to Charles the Bold, and I'm like, this man sounds insufferable. He was like so although I do feel bad for him because like all of these kids, all of these men, he had a very traumatizing event in his childhood when his mother was beheaded.

Daniel 9:26

So yeah.

Angela 9:29

Anyway, so around this time.

Daniel 9:30

Well, blame blame the people that beheaded your mom, don't blame witches.

Angela 9:35

Well, that would be too rational. How do you think Daniel wars have been fought for worse?

Daniel 9:40

I know for less. I know. I I expect too much of ancient kings.

Angela 9:45

Yeah. So at this time, an obscure playwright has just published a new play, and there are several lines and themes written into this play in honor of the new king. It's called Macbeth. Have you ever heard of it? So there's actually a lot of stuff that's written into Macbeth that are like little nods and winks to King James, and it's really funny to think about it. Like if I listened to a Taylor Swift album and she was like just pandering to like Donald Trump or something the entire time, I would be like, what the fuck is this nonsense?

Daniel 10:13

I mean, just listen to a kid rock album.

Angela 10:16

No, thank you.

Daniel 10:16

I have far better things to do with my time. Yeah, I definitely don't want my ears to bleed, so that's why I've avoided it as well.

Angela 10:22

Yeah, no, thank you. I I will not be attending that event. But it's like funny when you think about it in retrospect. Like Shakespeare was hustling. And I think for us also, it's hard to put ourselves into the time and into the place because Shakespeare was not Shakespeare at the time. Like he was he was hustling, he was working for it. He was not Shakespeare. Um I don't even know if in his entire lifetime if he ever was like really as famous as I don't think he would have any idea that we still that he's like such a colloquialism in modern times. But back at the time, he was just, you know, ass kissing. Um so he and his acting troop, they were trying to get into King James's good graces and just get that cash flow, which I understand that. I respect the hustle. Um so he wrote the line, though his bark cannot be lost, yet it shall be tempted tempest tossed, in reference to the tempest or the storm at sea that had almost killed the king. So there was like a little, like a little cheeky nod to him. Um okay, so there was something called the gunpowder plot where Catholics attempted to bomb Parliament and kill King James in 1606 or 1607. Um, so like that kind of set the entire theme for the play, where they were trying to kill the king, and obviously Macbeth, the whole entire like main plot line of Macbeth is that Macbeth kills Duncan to become the King of Scotland. So it's very much like on point, it's on theme. Also, I didn't know this, but Banquo, who's a famous character in Macbeth, he was written for he was like written like after a famous person in history who had been in the Scottish royal court, much like Lord Banquo in Macbeth. And it is well, it's disputed that Banquo was real, but at the time King James thought that he was related to the Stuarts, who this Banquo person was a part of that line and part of the Scottish royal dynasty. So Shakespeare turns Banquo into a hero, makes him loyal to the throne, and wrote in a prophecy that Banquo's descendants would be kings.

Daniel 12:22

Like he literally just like was like legitimate insert.

Angela 12:28

Yeah. Yeah, like this this was honestly laid on so thick when you think about it.

Daniel 12:34

Yeah, I think honestly, that is very reminiscent of what we're seeing today with our current president.

Angela 12:40

And like I feel like it's worth Shakespeareful, just like I need some money, we have this new king, let me like whip a little something up, let me see what I can do.

Daniel 12:49

Well, and that's I mean, that's what all the CEOs are doing.

Angela 12:52

Yeah, that's fair, yeah.

Daniel 12:53

I guess I'm just saying it's it's uh history is repeating itself, maybe.

Angela 12:56

Yeah, but I feel like I can't respect any of those people, but I probab I don't know, I I can still respect old old Shakespeare. Oh, yeah. He was just hustling, he was just out there trying to trying to make it trying to make ends meet. And we got Macbeth out of it. So there we go. But anyway, this brings us to the next part of the play, which I've always, always, always thought that the wayward sisters or the three witches were some of the most badass characters in theater. And I'm not like a huge Shakespeare buff or anything like that by any means, but like double double toil and trouble, cauldron brew, and um yeah, cauldron boiler. We'll get to it, we'll get to it.

Daniel 13:33

Yeah. I mean, that's iconic for a reason. I I mean, but yeah, so iconic, I just butchered the shit out of it. But like you're a kid, you know that. I mean Mary Cait and Ashley made the movie when we were in the 90s. Yeah. Double, what was it? Double double. Double double toil and trouble. Yeah, yeah. Amazing movie. If I don't remember anything about it.

Angela 13:52

No, I I remember it was it was art, it was a masterpiece. This is such a this is a very quick side path, but I loved the Mary Kate and Ashley Olson mystery movies. Like, like the I don't even know if I actually saw the Halloween one, but like all the other ones I have seen, and I know the theme song by heart. And once upon a time, I worked for a company where Mary Kate and Olson came and did a meeting, and I got to sit in a very, very, very large room and quietly sing Who's still the Great Hope Diamond. And now look how it's come full circle because like The Hope Diamond's on the list. It's on the list. Um, okay. So the witches are written into the play to kind of be the like they're not written in a positive light, obviously, because he's ass casing to King James, who writes entire demonologies about um witch hunting. So they're they're meant to be very like ominous and broody and scary. Um, but they really are the impetus for everything that Macbeth does in the play, and they prophesy that he'll become the king, and that sets him down his murderous path to the throne of Scotland. They represent darkness and chaos and even temptation.

Daniel 15:07

I love how they are into trickery as well. Like they're I mean, the prophecy they give him is sort of like tricks him into thinking he's invincible. They're tricksy. Yeah, and I it's like that they are in control, basically. They're like they're they're just like playing with their puppets.

Angela 15:23

Well, Shakespeare did a ton of research when he was writing The Witches, and he took from a lot of different folklore and a lot of different other references, especially and most obviously from Greek mythology. So um, they're clearly an interpretation of the fates, which are called the Morai, Clotho, Lacasis, and Atropos, and they weave their thread and tell the fates of men and gods, and Clotho is the spinner and spins the thread of life, and Lacisis measures the length of the thread, deciding how long a life will be, and Atropos cuts the thread with her shears representing death. So he had the three witches, and even actually in Act 4, Hecate, the Greek goddess of witchcraft shows up and like congratulates the witches on their brew. So it's very on point, but he really took from those themes of the prophecying and the three kind of crones who just are kind of spicy and they just kind of like weave their bullshit and it just fucks everything up, and they're so divine and delicious and delightful. Like, literally, they got the best lines in the play.

Daniel 16:24

I love what that says about modern audiences that yeah, like clearly Shakespeare was not trying to glorify these witches because the king of the time hated them.

Angela 16:32

I don't know. I think he was maybe kind of like doing a little bit of a backdoor thing.

Daniel 16:35

Maybe he's subversive.

Angela 16:36

I don't know. I mean, I could see him sort of like, I mean, we don't have his commentary on it. It's been lost to the to history and time, even if it had ever been written down. So it's hard for me to say, like, I'm sort of laying it on thick, this whole idea that he was just like ass kissing. Um, I mean, there obviously was he was doing something here. He was trying to get the favor of the king, and that obviously was for, you know, um money and for his um patronage. But he still, I mean, it's an incredible play for a reason. He put a lot of time and effort into it, he put a ton of research into it, and he really just even like the lines that he writes for the witches, it's like by the pricking of my thumbs, something wicked this way comes. Incredible. Yeah. There's no way he didn't write that down and just be like, fuck man.

Daniel 17:24

Like, could you imagine writing that and being like not knowing that, but writing something that then for hundreds of years people will be saying it's crazy.

Angela 17:32

Yeah, I mean, I watched the first half of Hamnet. My soul didn't have it in me to watch the second half at this time. Um, and they were like, I because I had just been doing my research for this episode, and they were um citing those lines. I think they even say, by the pricking of my thumb, something wicked this way comes, and like fair is fair, and something, something. The fact that people can memorize all these lines and go and like perform these plays, clearly I have a lot of respect for them because my little dumb dumb brain can't even remember, like, I have to be reading off of a page.

Daniel 18:05

Have you ever seen those people who will perform Shakespeare in the way that it used to be pronounced in the like in the old dialect? I'm like a nerd about that kind of stuff. And even I was like, okay, I am so over this.

Angela 18:17

Yeah, because like everything, it wasn't even just that they were like, Hark, father, I oh wait, sorry, that's a TikTok.

Daniel 18:24

That's a girl's none of the literally nothing sounds like English. You're just like, what are these words? They're saying it's I mean, if we traveled back in time, we wouldn't be able to communicate at we, I mean, when we joke around and are like, Daniel, didst hast thou lost thine life?

Angela 18:39

Like every time you don't text me back for too long, has thou gone to the other side of the mortal veil? Um no, like it's all like my huffend hath a th, like it's very Oh, all the vowels.

Daniel 18:52

Well, there was like a great vowel shift that happened since then. So just all the words were just nonsense, basically. It's it's insane. But it's funny because all the things that don't rhyme nowadays used to rhyme and make sense. So it's funny that like we Okay, actually, I don't know.

Angela 19:05

That's interesting because that brings us to act four, scene one, which is when the witches are circling their cauldron and they're brewing a potion. And this kind of negates what you just said, sorry, because it all does rhyme and it's an iambic pentameter, but also like just listen to what he wrote. So round about the cauldron go, in the poison and trails throw, toad that under cold stone, days and nights has thirty-one, sweltered venom, sleeping got, boil thou firsteth charmed pot, double double toil and trouble, fire burn and cauldron bubble. Fill it of a fenny snake, in the cauldron boil and bake, eye of new and toe of frog, wool of bat, and tongue of dog, adder's fork and blindworm sting, lizard's leg and howlet's wing, horrid charm of powerful trouble, like a hellbroth boil and bubble. And then all of the witches together say double double toil and trouble, fire burn and cauldron bubble. And that's just like a few bars, and it goes on for quite a bit. But you want to know what is interesting about this? I maybe just cursed us. Because Shakespeare did so much research and he pulled so much folklore in that the curse of Macbeth is not just like oh, don't say it in the theater. The curse of Macbeth comes from the fact that he put real incantations in.

Daniel 20:21

It's in the play itself.

Angela 20:23

Yes. And so people either think that when you speak them, you are literally speaking ancient magical incantations, or there's also a rumor that like a coven of witches at the time heard the play and they were so upset that he had used the ancient magics that they cursed the play. That's where the curse comes from. It's in the play.

Daniel 20:44

The call is coming from inside the play? The call is coming from inside the house. The call is coming from inside the house. I mean, old Billy Shakespeare pulling a super fast one on Western culture.

Angela 20:56

Isn't that so cool? Like, yes, they're forbidden chance. Like he cursed, the play is cursed because he wrote magic spells into it.

Daniel 21:08

That according who said they're cursed? Or who said they're do you want to hear the evidence?

Angela 21:12

Do you want to hear the evidence? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Daniel 21:14

Sorry, sorry.

Angela 21:14

I've Okay, so um, the first victim actually was taken the night of the opening of Macbeth. Like the first time the play was being performed, the actor playing Lady Macbeth in 1606 died just before the play opened, and Shakespeare had to play the part himself. But one caveat, it's 1606 dying is not the same kind of thing back then. It kind of happens more often and more more frequently.

SPEAKER_02 21:38

Right before the play, that's still bad. Yeah.

Angela 21:41

And so Shakespeare had to jump in and play Lady Macbeth, and so everyone was like, oh my gosh, it's cursed. Because I'm sure at the time also, there was the whole thing where that's probably where it began that there was like a coven saying that they were cursing.

Daniel 21:54

Well, and also it's like that thing where you sit down and they're like, attention, audience, tonight the part of Oh, and so we'll not be played by Bet Midler, but we'll be played by the understudy. Oh, Bet Midler's alive still, right?

Angela 22:08

No, no, no, not Bat Midler. Um my god, please, please, please don't let anything happen to Bet Midler. We will not be.

Daniel 22:15

If at least start cursing people, I will have to cancel the podcast.

Angela 22:20

No. Um, it wasn't me. It wasn't us.

Daniel 22:25

Sorry, the reason I brought Bet Midler into it is because that was a Seinfeld reference. There's an episode where that happens.

Angela 22:30

Okay, so like dying in 1606, not a feat, babe. Everyone's doing it.

Daniel 22:34

Like not necessarily an out-of-the-ordinary cursed just an it could just be another day that ends in Y in the 1600s.

Angela 22:42

Yeah, but in 1703 there was a severe storm called, now listen to this. It was called the Great Storm of 1703. Hit London on opening night, and Macbeth was not able to continue on. So that was also kind of a throwaway. But 1849 brings us to the Aster Place riot, and the Aster Place riot is a fucking riot in five different ways. So, first of all, it occurred in Manhattan at what was called the Ast Opera House. Um, but like the Ast Opera House wasn't making a lot of money in their opera run. Like, people didn't, like, they didn't have enough bougie people running around Manhattan at the time. So they had to start doing other shows and stuff to bring in more crowds. But there were these two famous actors. One was English, his name was Edwin Forrest, and the other was British, his name was William Charles McCrady. And they're both like notable actors of their time, and they both do a lot of like traveling throughout, you know, both of them are traveling throughout each other's countries and they're performing and they do a lot of Shakespeare performances. And it kind of comes down to it that they both are in a lot of Shakespeare plays, and they both are kind of like orbiting each other, and they start talking shit. And they actually kind of start having their own little friend, like their own little camps of fans, too. Like it was very like boy band era where like there were people who were fans of Forrest and there were people who are fans of McCrady, and also there was a lot of like nationalism around it. Like there were people who were you know anti-British and people who were anti-American, and it was like it was just you know a weird little storm that was brewing.

Daniel 24:27

It's so un annoying to hear that toxic fandom is just like a human trait through history.

Angela 24:32

Yeah, humanity is cyclical. I guarantee there was toxic fandom, like literally in the caves.

Daniel 24:39

I mean, I actually that's what we kind of like like when we I was looking into you know the Egypt stuff, they were like different religious cults that were basically like venerating different rulers into this, yeah, status. Yeah, just cells all the stupid.

Angela 24:50

This is essentially just how it goes. Um, so Forrest went to a performance of McCrady playing Hamlet and loudly hissed at him. And then McCrady announced that Forrest was without taste, and then this created a huge amount of scandal, and everyone was all just you know in a tussle over it, to the point where when McCrady was on stage in America, someone hurled the carcass of a dead sheep onto the stage at him. Like, is it like is it weird how much synergy our episodes have with each other?

Daniel 25:25

Yeah, there's all these carcasses constantly of ghosts. Yeah, like are you next you're gonna tell me that an airplane crashed in the year 1800 because that would be the appropriate for our discussion. At first I was gonna joke, like, oh, that was such a classy feud. Like I hiss, sure, that's a little much, and then calling someone tases, but they went straight to carcasses. Did you miss the part where I said this ends in a riot? You're right. I did forget that this was setting up a riot. You are you're correct. I did lose that thread.

Angela 25:54

So a couple nights before the riot, it's it's May 7th, 1849, and uh McCrady is scheduled to appear in Macbeth at the opera house. And it was actually operating under the name Astor Place Theater, because, like I said, they were they had to open themselves to the ratty crowd to come in. They needed the scabs to come and pay for their gilded theater because they didn't have enough people enjoying the opera that season. So Forrest is the American one, McCrady is the British one, McCrady is playing at the opera house and he's playing Macbeth. And so Forrest's supporters buy up hundreds of tickets to uh the performance, and they go because I thought it was gonna be one of those things like how 50 Cent bought like the whole entire round floor of Ja Rules uh performance.

Daniel 26:46

But like you said, this was called a riot.

Angela 26:49

So I'm imagining where they show up, they they throw things at the stage: eggs, potatoes, apples, lemons, shoes, bottles of stinking liquid, and ripped up seats.

Daniel 27:01

Stinking liquid, ew.

Angela 27:02

I don't know. This is just what the um Wikipedia said about it.

Daniel 27:06

At first, I was like, oh, some of those like potatoes stuff. I was like, huh, you got a stew going. But then bottles of stinking liquid.

Angela 27:17

But yeah, potatoes, apples, lemons, shoes. Um and they started shouting, shame, shame, down with the codfish aristocracy. Which we need to put that one in our back pocket.

Daniel 27:29

Although I was gonna say they need a better slogan writer, but sure.

Angela 27:34

I know. We currently we've got some good slogans coming out of our embroiled times. Down with the codfish aristocracy probably won't crack the top 10. So, anyways, in the meantime, Forrest he is performing in a different theater. He's also playing Macbeth, and he is just like hailed and cheered, and he even like like the crowd goes wild when he says the line what rhubarb senna or what purgative drug will scour these English hens. So, like, everyone's just like hot and bothered over this, and they are just stoking the fire. And so Forrest is having his performance where everyone's going buck wild. McCrady is literally getting bottles of stinking liquid thrown at him and being called the codfish aristocracy. And he is basically like, fuck this noise, I'm out of here. Literally, like, I'm on the next boat, out of here to Britain, like fuck you all, you'll never see my face again. But some fancy pants New Yorkers who were opera going um The Hoity Toity opera goers. The Hoity Toys, yes, they talk him into staying and continuing the rest of the nights of his performance, which was a really bad, bad, stupid idea. Because three nights later, McCrady takes the stage again as Macbeth, and a full-blown riot breaks out, and 10,000 people come. Wow. Yeah, they are in the streets and they are just fucking wild and out. 22 people died.

Daniel 29:04

Wow. Imagine 10,000 people getting that upset about theater today. I know. And then 22 people dying over theater rivalry. That's like talk about being over dramatic. Calm down everyone.

Angela 29:24

Seriously. I know. Can you imagine? Like, you know, like the scene from the town where he's like, we're gonna go fuck some people up, we're not like whatever. And he's like, whose car are we driving? Um, that's literally like somebody was like, we're gonna go fuck some people up because some British man played Macbeth. Not better than our forest played him. Like, can you imagine?

Daniel 29:45

Yeah, that is very unfortunate that people died because of this.

Angela 29:48

Yeah, and even more unfortunate was the reputation of the Aster Opera House, which did not survive this event, and they were called the Massacre Opera House, or my personal favorite disaster place is like Aster Opera House.

Daniel 30:02

That's amazing. I know that's a A plus wordplayment.

Angela 30:07

People were funny back then. So that was amazing, but it is not the end. So in 1937, Laurence Olivier was playing Macbeth, and a 25-pound stage weight fell inches from him, his sword broke and flew into the audience, and the production set designer died.

Daniel 30:21

Ooh.

Angela 30:22

Yikes. In 1942, in a John Gilgude production, three actors died, and the set designer died by suicide. Do not become a set designer for Macbeth, apparently.

Daniel 30:33

And just three actors died like during the city. Yeah, I looked into that one a little bit. During the course of the production?

Angela 30:41

So two actors playing The Witches died, the actor playing Duncan was replaced due to illness, and the set designer John Minton, he died by suicide shortly after the premiere. Um, because yeah, I was curious, so I tried to find a little bit more information about it, and I did not get those details. But the theater it was performed at, the Piccadilly Theatre, was bombed shortly after, but it was also in 1942, so that was a little bit time and place because this was in London.

Daniel 31:06

Yeah, that doesn't seem to have anything to do with the afterthought, that's an aside.

Angela 31:14

But I mean, you could have just been cursed to have been in London at that time.

Daniel 31:20

I guess. I mean, but they could have been they could have been performing Hamlet at that time.

Angela 31:24

Fair. Um, in 1947, the actor playing Macbeth, Har Harold Norman, was stabbed with a real sword during the stage fight and died. Fucking bleak.

Daniel 31:35

On like they accidentally had a sharp sword instead of a sta like a fake sword. Oh god, that's like Brandon Lee and the crow.

Angela 31:43

Yeah. In 1954, or 1948, Diana Winyard, the actress playing Lady Macbeth, fell 15 feet off the stage during the sleepwalking scene.

Daniel 31:53

Did she have her eyes closed?

Angela 31:56

I don't know. Um I mean, probably it was like a dark set and like.

Daniel 32:02

I appreciate commitment to the role, but she's probably like staring at her hands.

Angela 32:07

Right? Yeah.

Daniel 32:08

She only fell. She was fine.

Angela 32:11

Yeah. Yeah. 15 feet, not great. Not that I won't lie.

Daniel 32:18

Recently I was talking with my husband, and I was like, what's the highest you've ever fallen from? Just talk, like thinking. And I was like thinking back to my childhood. Is this what married people do? Is this what marriage is all about? Just like a thought I had. I was like, what's the fall highest I've ever fallen from in my life and survived? And I was like thinking through my childhood of the shockingly numerous times I've like fallen off roofs or trees and stuff, and I don't know how I'm still alive.

Angela 32:43

Uh yeah, I fell off of a ladder onto a patio, like a brick patio, and like tore something in my arm. This was I don't think you were there, but this was when we were teenagers, and I remember I had like a pterodactyl arm for a few days. Not ideal.

Daniel 33:02

A 15-foot fall is terrifying.

Angela 33:04

Well, it gets better. Honestly, I really don't even know what people were thinking because in 1954, Charlton Heston suffered severe burns to his legs and groin from costumes soaked in kerosene.

Daniel 33:16

Oh, just great idea. Just soak soak your clothes in flammable fluids.

Angela 33:22

I mean, I know they were like doing all kinds of stupid shit in the 50s. Like, I don't remember when all the Wizard of Oz stuff was, but like that was just like an absolute hellscape. Yeah. Yeah. Um, but what the fuck? And then, I mean, you would think that they would have learned a little bit more about cause and effect. I think most of these people have been through an entire fucking world war and they're soaking their clothes in kerosene 10 years later. I mean, and maybe it was an accident, but still I have that you smell kerosene. That is not an accident. You're being too kind. Okay, and then 2011 was the most recent one on the list. Actor Jonathan Slinger was knocked off his bike and broke his arm on his way to the theater. That one I think doesn't count. Like he was just on his way to the plane, just being dumb and got knocked off his bike. Well, he I don't know, maybe he wasn't being dumb. He's probably in New York City. And you know, I really can't fault anyone because I in the city of Chicago uh have definitely almost been hit by cars. And like definitely, like every time I'm walking somewhere, I'm just like, ugh, today's the day I'm gonna see someone get absolutely popped like a gusher by a car.

Daniel 34:26

Head on a swivel and assume every car does not see you. Those are my rules when I'm walking. I know it's no fun.

Angela 34:32

Well, there is some good news about this curse is that there is a remedy. So now you never say the name like Beth in the theater. You will bring bad luck on the production. You must refer to it as the Scottish play, which you obviously knew because at the beginning of the podcast you called it the Scottish play or whatever, I can't do the accent.

Daniel 34:52

That's can I can I mean that's really all I knew about it. I just know it's like you don't say the name. And that's to me, the cultural consciousness of it is just that kernel, right? Like, is that sort of where you started with Yes, that's what I thought.

Angela 35:04

And um, luckily though, if you do accidentally say the name Macbeth in the theater, tradition dictates that you must leave the building, turn around three times, spit, curse, and then ask to be let back in. So, like, what a like nice um full circle moment, like you spit and then you curse to like undo the curse.

Daniel 35:24

Mm-hmm.

Angela 35:25

I love I love a full circle moment.

Daniel 35:27

Yeah, I mean that one seems a little bit like someone was just like uh you know who came up with that? It's again it's like the hogie pokey to me. Oh, yeah, it's just superstition. Is is there anything did you see anything about like people who read the play, or it's always productions, is there movies or anything?

Angela 35:44

No, it's pretty much production. Yeah, it seems to be very production-based, so a lot of us are probably just naturally safe from this curse, which is good news, unless you decide to go riot in the street over two rival actors and get yourself killed. At which point you potentially had it coming.

Daniel 36:01

Yeah, I hope all the fall in there were were participants in the riot and not bystanders.

Angela 36:05

I know. Um, do you think that I cursed us, perhaps? Um, I mean I didn't say the whole thing. I didn't say the whole thing aloud on our podcast.

Daniel 36:16

Okay. I mean, if this if that cursed us by reading it out loud, every high school class in America, and I assume English, I don't know what they're I mean, have you been to high school high school?

Angela 36:27

Maybe that explains what's going on. But that's how I met you. But what if we like literally timeline back and realized that we have both been in like junior year? Um, I remember I was in like AP Shakespeare, yeah, and we were like reading Macbeth.

Daniel 36:45

If reading it was gonna curse you, every high school class in America would be cursed. We'd all be cursed. We've all heard.

Angela 36:52

Sounds a bit sounds a bit too coincidental.

Daniel 36:55

I mean, well, when the when the curse is everyone, everything fits the you know, can become an example.

Angela 37:00

Yeah, fair. But I mean, I guess that brings us around to the age-old question. Do you think that the Macbeth play is cursed?

Daniel 37:12

Um, I I d I mean I do think it's pretty great that Shakespeare like looked into it and added a real curse that's kind of hilarious and meta and great. Like that's that I makes me really appreciate him even more. Um Yeah.

Angela 37:30

That's why I was like feeling really bad that I was giving him such a hard time about like being on his knees with the colour. Yeah, because then he included a real curse.

SPEAKER_02 37:36

So he's like, screw you, witches are gonna get you. That's amazing.

Angela 37:39

Well, he just like wrote some badass fucking characters and gave them some insanely good lines.

Daniel 37:46

So I mean, I guess I love that little aspect of it, but I don't think that the I mean, the play has been it's one of the most widely read and performed plays in the English speaking world since its writing. Uh you know, a dozen or so examples of people having misfortunes during it and a a riot and you know, a bombing from World War II. So you even when some of those examples you really have to just be like, well, those are just world events.

Angela 38:11

So I think there's not that there, but I do Yeah, like the lady dying in 1607 before the play, it's like everybody was dying in 1607.

Daniel 38:19

Was it a lady or was it a man at that time playing?

Angela 38:22

Um, you know what? I actually think it was a man. And then but yeah, well, because when did I I think the Wikipedia said like they it said them, it like didn't gender them.

Daniel 38:30

And I was like, that's that's my understanding is back then it was always men.

Angela 38:33

I don't think women were allowed to be.

Daniel 38:34

I mean, in the the historical documentary Shakespeare and Love, uh it was a scandal when a woman actually played.

Angela 38:41

Have you never Oh yeah? I don't think I've seen it.

Daniel 38:45

Well, let me fill you in. Gwyneth Paltrot pretends to be a man so she can act.

Angela 38:49

What if I got so pissed at you for spoiling that? I saw like uh something on TikTok on Twitter or something where someone got pissed off. Yeah. What was the movie that they spoiled and somebody was like infuriated about it? And it was like, you had 25 years.

Daniel 39:02

People get mad about like the sixth sense being spoiled and stuff like that.

Angela 39:05

Wow, it happens in the same way. You're joking.

Daniel 39:07

Okay. I'm sorry. I can't believe I ate that bookline and sinker.

Angela 39:17

Maybe it's time to be done. Anyway, what I was getting was talking.

Daniel 39:20

Can I I'll get back to my point. I will reel myself back into that point. Uh I I don't think there's a real curse, but I do think that Shakespeare adding in that little bit makes it cursed-ish to me. There's like there's that little kernel of truth there.

Angela 39:33

Yes. Okay. See, I was fully, I wanted to hear what you thought before I really put together what I thought because I have no mind of my own. Um no, but I agree. Like, I think it's so badass that he put an actual spell in and that it potentially cursed the play. Um, so I think, yeah, I agree. It cursed itch, but I do think that all of the things that have happened as a result are really just like the usual shit of happenstance, time and place, people being petty, people being crappy, people being ridiculous. It's just life. The what did I say on the top of the skullduggery that comes along with life? But yeah, I feel like we are firmly in the camp of cursed ish, though, because of the incantation.

Daniel 40:16

So maybe cursed, maybe not.

Angela 40:19

Yeah, see you next week. Cursed-ish is an ish media production. It explores stories of alleged curses, historical mysteries, and supernatural claims. While we do investigate the history and the evidence behind these stories, ultimately you should decide for yourself what to believe. If you have questions, comments, or your own accursed tales to share, send us a hex at uhoh at cursedish.com. That's uh oh h all one word at cursdish all one word.com